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June 6, 2008
$5,000 REWARD for sale of Petersburg home
We’ve all heard of monetary incentives offered to realtors to encourage the sale of houses… but an offer to the general public? In this failing housing market, people are going to new lengths to sell homes.
After watching their house sit on the market for nearly nine months, and dropping the price more than $50,000, (from $324K to $269K) home owners Christopher and Christine Shorr have gotten desperate.
The Shorr’s purchased the dilapidated sixteen room mansion in 2000, and spent five years restoring it—putting in modern upgrades, but retaining the house’s nineteenth century character. The historic 3800 square foot Colonial Revival style house was built in 1891, and sits on a corner lot facing Petersburg’s Central Park. Christopher Shorr, a theatre director, founded a performing arts venue in Old Towne Petersburg called Sycamore Rouge. Christine Shorr, a kitchen designer and artist, is the owner/operator of Artistic Interiors, which provides decorating and kitchen design services.
“It’s a gorgeous house, and its priced to sell,” said the Shorr’s realtor, Gina Harrison of Joyner Fine Properties in Richmond. “It was even featured in the Times-Dispatch as an example of how much house your money can buy. But in this market, even a great house at a great price doesn’t guarantee anything. It’s frustrating, but that’s the reality of this market.”
The couple is relocating to Pennsylvania, where Mr. Shorr will be running the theatre program at Moravian College. “We kept putting off the move, hoping to sell the house first,” explained Mr. Shorr. “But at some point we had to go ahead and schedule the move and hope for the best.” It seems that hoping was not enough. The couple decided to take action. Mrs. Shorr commented: “In this economy, everyone needs money. We thought–an easy $5,000 for anyone who convinces a friend to buy our house?–someone’s going to jump on that!”
So what exactly is the deal? The Shorrs are offering $5000 (to be paid at settlement) to any person who refers a buyer to them resulting in the sale of their house by the end of July. The buyer will need to confirm that the person made the referral. With a total of $5000 available, multiple people cannot receive the reward. Who do the Shorrs think will rise to the challenge? “It could be a realtor, it could be the buyer himself, it could be some random guy who tells a friend, ‘hey—I know this terrific house—you should really take a look,’” stated Mr. Shorr. “We don’t care. We’ve got $5000 up for grabs for whatever person helps us close the deal.”
For more information about the house, contact Gina Harrison at 804-640-2237, go to www.joynerfineproperties.com, or take a virtual tour.
Beautiful house; interesting tactics; let’s see if they work…
Does that mean you could refer yourself and use the $5K towards closing costs? =)
Probably, but then you’d have to buy the house! — which, by the way, *really* is a great house.
definitely looks like it–however, the area is not great. There’s been a bunch of car breakins, burglaries, and drug-related crime in the vicinity, which no doubt is a big part of why this won’t move.
While I believe the intent was certainly not to damage the potential for a sale, words like “a bunch of car breakins, burglaries, and drug-related crime in the vicinity” cannot possibly work to increase awareness of the great potential for life in our city.
Those who know little about the advantages of Petersburg cannot help but be discouraged by such a description. I, for one, thank God every day for setting my sights on Petersburg. There is, indeed, much to be done to return Petersburg to glory … and fortunately, there are many people who believe we can make progress.
Admittedly, as a resident of Petersburg, I sometimes find myself shaking my head and wondering … but then I think about the history of survival this incredible city has experienced and the generations that did not give up. The prospects are endless.
Sooner or later, we, as caretakers of Petersburg, must develop and PROFESS a sincere attitude of hope if our city is to rise above the negative. I for one, hope we refocus sooner than later.
Our city must move forward. In order to continue this path of change, we must believe in a sense of community and create opportunities to share what is good about Petersburg whenever we can. I would love to see a series of comments expressing the opportunities and prospects our city offers.
Anybody up for that challenge?
MaryJane,
Our city is in a transition. The process of that transition will cause some pain.
The direction is clearly up, but I have my self-satisfied smirk on when I recall how I predicted an uptick in crime when the cost of living in the area went up, while the skills of the original residents remained stagnant.
These problems will be worked out, but not by next tues.
The shorrs’ house certainly is fantastic, and if one can leverage the money, it is a great investment. I think the challege is in people getting loans for over $200k right now. Banks are belatedly cautious.
That smirk comes from remembering saying that crime was liable to go up before eventually plummeting, and having those comments dismissed by those thinking omlets can be made without eggs breaking.
The exterior is great (the porch is PERFECT for hanging out with neighbors and friends), the interior photos I’ve seen are STUNNING. IMHO, I think one thing that may be keeping it from selling is that wretched little modular rancher it looks like some former owner plopped in the back yard which drastically cut down on the size of the current yard.
Hey, less yard is a good thing to some folks. Less grass to cut!
In response to MaryJane- I’d be happy to add comments reflecting a positive view of Petersburg. We lived in Prince George nine years ago (my husband retired from the Army out of Ft. Lee). I said then (and have ever since) that I thought Petersburg’s redevelopment was due and and an excellent opportunity for those who could stick out the transition. I only wish I would have put my money where my mouth was back then :-) As soon as we get our house in Richmond sold or rented, Petersburg is our next move! The Gilliam House is quite lovely and I wish the owners all the best.
I heard a news blurb about this on the way home from work (listening to - I think - Channel 6 News). Free publicity is always a good thing!
Since I’m good at it, I’ll play devil’s advocate for a moment. First off, I’m all about someone making a profit on their investment (if they really only paid $9,000 for the house in 2000 as the assessor’s site indicates) but, if the house has sat for so long, is it possible the asking price maybe still too high?
I remember when we sold our house in Richmond (of course this was in 2006) but, we made sure we listed to many of our realtor friends and priced it so that it would move. We didn’t want to have to keep lowering the price - then people think something is wrong or they will just wait to see it go even lower. We bought it for $106K and 6 years later sold it for $219.5K (as I said, I’m all about making a profit) and we had 3 full price offers THE DAY it hit MLS - no open house, no nothing.
Just saying - not sure what they invested in the remodel and so forth ($324K - $9K (if that is an accurate report as I mentioned)= $315K worth of improvements??) but maybe they might want to look at making a “little” less profit just to unload the thing. *shrug*
side note - the previously mentioned realtor friends really drove home the point that the seller ALWAYS thinks their home is worth more than it really probably worth because…well….it’s their home and they’ve put tons of their time, heart, and attention into it. they recommended that we just step back and look at it from a business point of view, not a “heart” point of view.
cold? unfeeling? not what people want to hear? maybe but, hey .. just my 2 cents because money today is worth more than money tomorrow (or 9 months) I always say.
http://www.wtvr.com/Global/story.asp?S=8466002
I saw this yesterday–and, as pointed out by Chuck, it’s being made clear and obvious to everyone that the house–clearly in need of major refurbishment–was bought for 9k eight years ago. How much did those refurbs cost? As a prospective homebuyer, the differential between the 2k cost and the asking price rasies my eyebrows.
Also, I’ve seen “nine fireplaces” mentioned in a few places. If this is like most of the historic homes in the area, dollars to donuts none of them are open, right?
It’s still a lovely house, and I’m glad this unique method is getting press–but there’s some simple questions raised here in the whole process. I suppose that’s the whole point of caveat emptor, though.
Folks, lenders aren’t so giving these days, and since when is what one put into a renovation relevant to its value (renovation costs are sunk costs; econ 101 explains about sunk costs)? The house’s appraisal is $350,000, and the ask is now below assessment. Further, as anyone in/from Richmond or points north knows, a house of that size and condition is a great buy at $269,000. Plus, it’s in a historic district!
Re: fireplace, I know of several vintage homes in the area that have working fireplaces. Whether that is an asset comes down to personal taste. Some people like the smell of burning wood, some do not. Some like the look/feel of a fire when entertaining, some would rather not have their heat going up the flue, especially with the current price of home heating. (For example, our working fireplace had no damper in it; we now have one, to keep the main oil-fired heat in the home.)
Also, I think it is easy to armchair posit what someone else could or could not do. Fact is, we are not in their shoes. I applaud the Schorrs and their realtor for their innovative/proactive way of engaging in the current market. Really interesting idea!
: )
Hi folks! It’s great to see so much discussion about our house. (I guess sometimes it really does “take a village” to sell a house!) I thought I’d address a couple of issues that have come up. First, in terms of crime, we have had no problems in our eight years on this corner (except for having some tools stolen during the first six months of rennovation) which includes no problems with cars–despite having a Mercedes and an SUV parked in our driveway. Although I have not checked crime stats lately, I know that Petersburg has always felt safer to me than New York, Baltimore, and even Richmond, where I’ve lived in the past.
Regarding the fireplaces: Yes, there are nine of them, spead over three chimneys. Sadly, we’ve never had them looked at by a chimney contractor, so I can’t be sure of the condition. Most of them are loosely closed up with bricks. Because of this, we refer to them as “non-working” fireplaces, though we had planned on putting gas logs in a couple. Regarding the purchase price, yes–we did in fact buy the house for $9000 in 2000. It had been “red-tagged” (deemed uninhabitable) by the city, and had been empty for several years prior to our purchase.
Our first phase of renovations cost $137,000. That addressed structural issues, demolition (it had been divided into 4 apts), all new plumbing, all new electrical, new 2-zone central air and gas heat, and rebuilding the three porches. Since then, (over the last five or six years) we’ve also replaced roofs, installed a custom kitchen, and done a lot with the interior over all. It has been an expensive project!
If we get our current price, which is $269,000, that will allow us to pay off our mortgage and equity line, pay our realtor’s commission, pay the $5000 reward, and allow us to pocket $10,000 for a down payment on our next house. This wasn’t the plan. We’d hoped for the house to be a better investment, and I think if we could have pushed through this housing slump it would have been. But circumstances have a way of changing those plans…
At this point, we’re looking to do little more than break even. At $269,000, the house really is a bargain. Christine and I have poured a lot of love into Petersburg, and we are hoping that the person who buys our house will appreciate the community as much as we have.
I had to use my Wiki-Fu. It says sunk costs are costs that have been incurred and which cannot be recovered to any significant degree.
Are you saying that money invested in a kitchen remodel will not net you more at resale than your initial investment? I’d always heard contrary. If it was an inground pool - yeah I’d agree - I’ve heard you actually lose money on those things.
Posit….I like that word - will have to use it! Oh I know I’m not in their shoes, and frankly, given the current market, I thank the Baby Jebus for that one. Especially if they are dealing with a bridge loan. I also applaud them and the newest realtor - hope it works out for them, I really do.
HA I just used my big word for the day on someone! Well, it’s smaller than ‘postulate’ or ‘make an assumption’ but…it was fun to see the look on their face!
Fun with words!
Most weird tangent — I read the other day a headline in the WSJ about spelling protesters showing up at a spelling bee… here’s the article.
Just occurred to me to check what Wiki has to say about sunk costs. It has a pretty good discussion about sunk costs, the sunk cost fallacy, loss aversion, etc. Here.
Oops, I was typing #21 b/f #18 went live.
That first line of the definition of sunk costs is not so helpful in understanding them. Focus on this part of the def: “Economics proposes that a rational actor does not let sunk costs influence one’s decisions, because doing so would not be assessing a decision exclusively on its own merits.” I think the ‘cannot be recovered’ language is a bit confusing… this part is meant to say that sunk costs are costs that have been realized, cannot be reversed, that are not variable — you paid them, full stop. Since you cannot undo such history, they should not matter to the decision of whether to sell, or at what price. Now this is entirely different from economic profit or loss, which is the difference between your realized sale price and any costs you incurred in relation to the asset (e.g., purchase price, carrying costs). And, yes, one usually desires to sell at a price that is greater than the sum of such costs, in which case they realize an economic profit (yay!) upon sale. But consider wherefrom ‘cut your losses’ comes: this means that while you may incur a loss to get out of a position, doing so is better than riding the loss down. This sell now vs. later decision should be based entirely on your expectation of where you can sell at today vs. in the foreseeable future — not on what you paid to get into the position. In yet a different context, a firm should not shut down as long as it is covering all its variable costs, making some sort of contribution toward its fixed/sunk costs (thereby minimizing the loss). I don’t mean to focus on loss scenarios, as the role of sunk costs is the same in profit scenarios, but I think the intuition of what they are exactly and why they should be off the table is easier to see in the loss scenarios. Or maybe Wiki well clarifies by suggesting that between the decision to sell at your asset at $A and the decision to sell your asset at $B, because you have the same history of costs in either scenario, this factor ‘cancels out’ in the decision making…
Chris — that is awesome that you gave new life to what was formerly red-tagged! May our city’s currently condemned stock of houses see such an outcome. And much luck to you guys.
NO FAIR B! #22 is making my eyes go all squiggly.
So maybe that wasn’t my best devil’s advocate bit…sheesh.
Actually I keep showing the house (well online at the Joyner website) to everyone at work. They all think the house is stunning - LOL a few even really like the bathtub planter!!
I’m really trying to pour it on for a new faculty member but, he and his wife are eyeing those God awful McMansions in the west end….you know postage stamp sized yards; hollow plastic shutters; every third/fourth house looks like yours; and no mature trees - all for the bargin basement price of about half a mill.
Unfortuantely chuck, you just described the dream of MOST homebuyers.
A far as your question about remodeling… it really depends.
Kitchen/bathroom are considered the easiest to recoup, but I think the numbers are still only about 80-90%, assuming you let others do all the work.
If you do the work yourself, and grab bargins as they come, you can make a lot, esp. if the orignal is super-dreary.
Generally, unless your house is apprieciating fast, you want to live in it as long as possible to enjoy the upgrades.
For most people, the price of gas will now be a prime factor up there with schools (if they have kids) in the “where do we want to live” decision process.
At a buck a gallon (And I’m old enough to remember filling a gallon can with a quarter) living in P’burg and working in Richmond is not a big deal. The only thing you’d think about is the time factor.
At 4+ a gallon it now becomes almost impossible because you are spending money to to to work, effectively taking a pay cut.
Gasoline prices are going to drive several things. More bikes, motorcycles/scooters and more people living in the city.
Exactly why light rail service between Richmond and Petersburg would be a boon to commuters. They had it in the 19th Century and it worked wonderfully. Why not today?
RAIL. YES.
I actually checked into the Amtrak thing…yes, I can get from Petersburg to Main Street Station … and then a quick walk up to the MCV Campus BUT, I have to go to Staples Mill first then come back South and the whole trip takes an obscene amount of time.
You can take the P’Burg to Richmond bus (GRTC) for $5/day. Factor in daily/monthly parking plus weekly fuel and $25/week is quite a bargin!
Oh I found Premium 93Oct. for $4.09 at a Texaco Station out Washington Hwy yesterday….sad day when I think of that as a “good deal” but when it’s $4.25+ in Richmond…there are some perks to living in the ‘burg! =)
Might I suggest we move the discussion about fuel/commuting to a separate thread? I’d like to comment on this and see other opinions which might not materialize in this thread.
will do in a bit.Done! Click here.I see Joyner’s no longer listing the house–did this work? Did it move?
When we were out and about today, looked like the Joyner sign was still up and…..added bonus…..there was a Contract Pending sign atop said sign. *Thumbs Up*….or maybe *Crosses Fingers*
The Shorrs Home did close and was sold by me : ) Gina Harrison with Joyner.
Please stop by and say Hello to our new resident.
The property sold for 267,500.00
Well all the prayers, crossed fingers, voo-doo rituals, and the magic of Gina Harrison and Dave Walker and I am the blessed new owner of this beautiful HOME and grateful resident of Petersburg!
I share Mary Jane’s sentiments and I am thankful that I was led to Petersburg by a friend.
I work at Fort Lee and could have moved to any of the neighboring cities; but it was the warm welcome(saving grace) that I received beginning with my 2nd week on the job from Cynthia Devereaux, to “cinnamon” and friends at Java Mios, to the eclectic group I call the Marshall Street Crew and even the folks in my old neighborhood on Halifax Street that I decided to “Grow Where thou Art Planted,” as my Granny always says and decided to make Petersburg my home!
I come from Detroit and have witnessed and been a part of neighbor “blight busters” and revitalization. And see nothing but potential when I walk through ALL AREAS of Petersburg and talk to people in the community and invite people from post to go with me to see the wonder potential of an up and coming city; and encourage soldiers and (whomever else will listen) to patronize Petersburg and to judge for themselves as I did.
It takes a community and people like all of you who have helped me, and encouraged me, and supported me, and welcomed me, and who have “stuck it out” and saw its potential when family and friends and corporations were trying to convince you to leave, to get the blood once again pumping through the veins of this glorious city.
I don’t know about you but I’m PUMPED and have nothing but time and energy and just looking for a victim or yet an opportunity to unleash them both…so look out Petersburg!
So say what you want, do what you will, bring on your best Petersburg but I’m ready!
Thanks again, Petersburg choosing to show me your best and welcoming me with open arms!